Is Winter Over?

The short answer is…very likely not.

But how about that weather today!   I rode my bike this afternoon here at work and it felt like March.  The sunshine after the morning sprinkles was very nice!  Temps surged again into the 55-60 degree range, about 10 degrees above average.

I just checked the monthly numbers for AST, PDX, SLE, EUG, RDM, & PDT.  All are running 5 to 8 degrees above average this month, completely negating the cold weather of December.  It looks like it’ll turn more average for the last week of the month, but January 2010 will definitely go down in the record books as a warm one.  As of today it’s the 3rd warmest January on record here;  right after 2006.

BUT, I don’t want to hear any whining about the mild weather yet from you weather freaks:

1. We can get a decent arctic blast into about the 2nd week of February. That gives us a 3-4 week window now in which we need to keep a close eye peeled to the north.  After that, daytime temps climb dramatically on sunny days due to the increasing sun angle.  So we can get a chunk of arctic air the latter part of February, but the sunshine pushes us up into at least the 30s.  It was 2006 when that happened; one day in the 30s and then it hit 40 the following day.

2. We could get an “all-day” type snow event through the last week of February or first few days of March. And yes, I know a trace or so could fall even in the lowlands in the month of March, but that is very rare.  We all remember 2008 and the spring break snow in the hills.  But even then no day had a high temperature lower than 46 degrees at PDX!  So you’re dreaming if you think we’ll get significant snow in March.  Oh, make sure you copy-paste that last statement so you can throw it back in my face when if we ever get a 10″ snowfall for spring break.

3. Should I unwrap my pipes or take my snow tires off? NO.  As I just mentioned, we could easily get a snowstorm, and your pipes should stay wrapped for the next 3 weeks or so.  Now if we get to Valentines Day and there is no sign of a cold snap at that point, then go ahead and turn the faucets back on.

Speaking of the next few weeks, it looks to me as if we are heading maybe a bit more “splitty” with a better chance for cooler easterly flow at the surface returning again.  Next week doesn’t look very exciting to me, although the GFS appears wetter than the ECMWF.  It (ECMWF) has very little rain next week at all after Monday morning.

Chief Meteorologist Mark Nelsen

119 Responses to Is Winter Over?

  1. lurkyloo says:

    Don’t leave, Rob.

    What is in the water (or weather, karma, vibes?) that is making this weirdness happen? There are lots of us who admire and appreciate your knowledge. Ignore the fools. They wanted to “get your goat.” Are you missing a goat? Don’t give in to it anymore! I’m not asking you to take a bashing laying down … but heck, look at the source.

    • Matthew says:

      I hope you stay Rob, because your one of the most knowledgeable none pro-weather people within the pacific northwest. I respect and feel that you have a lot to give towards this weather blog. Keep on doing what you enjoy doing.

      As for the weather, I don’t see any chance for snow over the next 3 days. In my personally opinion this winter kind of stinks.

    • PDX Weather Nut says:

      Not whining but just a concern for climate change. We have had just one month of winter. Should this pattern continue for future years it will cause drastic changes. Imagine all the snow on Mt. Hood gone halfway through the summer. In addition people seem to forget just how hot last summer was with multiple 100 + degree days and breaking the all the record for 90 + degree days.

    • PDX Weather Nut says:

      Channel 8 said yesterday that we are on track for the second warmest January of all time here in Portland.

  2. Timmy_Supercell (Hillsboro) says:

    I think I’ll get some rest and start fresh tomorrow on the blog.

  3. Timmy_Supercell (Hillsboro) says:

    Oops, Yevpolo1990 already mentioned this 🙂

  4. Timmy_Supercell (Hillsboro) says:

    Latest infrared satellite image shows a large developing low off 165W – 35N

    Looking somewhat similar to the pattern that developed about a week ago.

  5. pdxgeol says:

    Went to Meadows today. Great skiing. Checked out the aftermath of that avalanche in Mark’s previous post! Wow, what an awesome sight. There was some serious energy involved.

  6. yevpolo1990 says:

    anyone noticed a trend where models are pushing sunday low more east now?

  7. Steve Pierce (Vancouver, WA.) says:


    When: SATURDAY, JANUARY 23rd 2-4pm!
    Where: STARK STREET PIZZA – 9234 SE Stark Street
    Topic: How to interpret weather charts and model soundings, with AMS Councilor, Steve Pierce.

    This will be a great opportunity for beginning / amateur weather enthusiasts to learn about how to interpret weather charts and model soundings (great for forecasting potential snow events). We hope you can come.

    Check for updates at our website:

    Oregon AMS

  8. Matthew says:

    No snow based on the gfs throughout the 384 hours. We few storms that could give us some heavy rain, but -2c to 5c at 850 mbs. After about Feb 15h you can pretty much call winter over, because it is very rare for snow later into the season than that. I believe that the next few months will be near or slightly above normal and slightly wetter than normal.

    Have a good evening all at fox12 weather blog!!!

  9. yevpolo1990 says:

    Rob I am with what you said about everything but the mark part! But seriously guys common now, this is a weather blog why would we want to make life harder on mark? just think about it…

    Weather now!
    I actually expected a sunny day, so much for that just a bunch of cloudiness in the morning and now rain, i am really interested in what will this next storm bring! Lets hope it can give us a windstorm, I have been lookin at the surface analysis (
    and they are still projecting a sharp N/NE turn. However since i looked at this for 2 days and saw every forecast, they still can’t handle this low. So like Rob said satellite must be kept track of, however still must be somewhat paid attention to, since models are kind of good at predicting the cold air. But yea as of now lets see what satellite says in these 3 days. Also Rob remember how you told me when the Jet moves more North the storm maybe caught in it and possibly bring it into out area! We will see.
    Otherwise: I think i should be able to make the AMS meeting tomorrow, but not exactly sure as of now still..I am like 80% sure I will come (this is like my longest post i am sure haha)

  10. chehalem mountain says:

    good lord, this is a weather blog, simply a weather blog.
    stop this nonsence…

  11. pgiorgio says:

    Agreeeeeee 100$ Rob

  12. pgiorgio says:

    Agreed 100% Rob

  13. Rob "Wrath" S.E. Portland says:

    You people are pathetic…. Cause significant problems, then mock me, mock everything, insult everyone, and now you have the balls to sit here and post like you’re saints, like everyone is just a-okay. What a joke. I’m amazed you’re not even banned. .. And give it up you could care less about Haiti. The only people you care about are yourselves you proved that with your repeated selfish immature behavior…

    Yeah nice job Mark way to go you really solved the problem still allowing these idiots to be here. Well since you apparently have no idea how to run a blog, Mark, and since you evidently could give a damn about myself being excessively bashed for hours I have no faith in you or this blog…. It’ll just happen again and again, and what will you do, Mark? Nothing. Exactly just like the past dozen or so times. If you’re so busy you can’t handle idiots on a blog, then don’t have one.


    • Rob "Wrath" S.E. Portland says:

      Oh and Mark, they know you’re a softy and will never ban them, they USE you too.. They use that and keep doing this crap… So let me understand…. When I login and I’m bashed I’m just supposed to accept that? or ignore it… that’s absolutely ridiculous. Extremely fair to me and others.

      I’ll have to start my own weather blog or something.

    • Ben says:

      Wow! Take your meds!

    • Sandi (Wilsonville) says:

      Rob, please be respectful of Mark. Wasn’t your biggest complaint lack of respect for you? Mark asked that this be dropped, so drop it.

    • pgiorgio says:

      It can’t be dropped if the PROBLEM was never taken care of. Really, its that simple.

    • Mat the Salmon Killer says:

      Rob, the Snowman sent me all that was posted earlier. You did way more than your fair share of bashing yourself. Additionally, you threatened bodily harm. Please relax and the way you are disrespecting Mark is ridiculous. As mentioned previously, drop it and let this thing go. Dragging this on the way you are is doing nothing positive for this blog. I admit to not always being an angel, but come on, enough is enough.

    • Carl in Cascade Park says:

      With all due respect Rob, Mark deleted all the comments to give everybody a second chance and to COOL off. Call it a start over if you will. This is how I see it. Yet here you are, starting it all over again so this time I blame YOU. Let it go man, it is not worth it. You are dealing with people who sit behind a computer and they can say anything they want to just to see you get upset and they get off on it. Be the bigger man and stop this nonsense. I respect you Rob, I really do and I appreciate your wisdom but at this very moment, you are acting far more childish than the others. If you’re going to quit. THEN QUIT! And do not come back. I wish you wouldn’t but you are acting like a little snot and you want Daddy to protect you, It’s not going to happen friend. Cool off, take a break, have a beer (Or several) and come on back.

    • McMinnvilleDude says:

      I have been watching this blog since early December, and Rob is the only person I really pay attention to. The data you post and the knowledge you have behind your posts have been intriguing.

      I’m sad to see what this has come to. Assuming this garbage doesn’t stop, are their any other blogs out there like this?

    • McMinnvilleDude says:

      And Rob, if you read this, I’m not saying this is your fault (I have read all of the posts), but you should really lighten up. Don’t stoop to their level, keep this thing fun to read. Every person that says “Hey Rob, lighten up” or similar is saying that because they hold you to higher regard than the other guys. Since early December I have yet to see a logical thought posted from any of the ‘other guys’.

    • ghcshweather says:

      I didn’t see the alleged broo haha!!

      But Rob, seriously, you need to quit taking things personally and flying off the handle, you did this on western, if you don’t agree or like what someone says wouldn’t it be easier to just let it go instead of antagonizing and making the situation worse.

      Blogs are all about opinion, negative and positive, reacting in a negative way does not say much for any person that does it.

      You are respected, but reacting the way you do sometimes ruins that.

      Sometimes people will disagree with you, get over it.

    • Rob "Wrath" S.E. Portland says:

      I’m sick of this…. You don’t know anything #1. #2 this isn’t western where I was berated and insulted day after day after day… Oh wait that’s what happened on here. Disagree with me? what does personally attacking me have to do with that? Nothing. People who don’t know what they are talking about shouldn’t say anything. You don’t know me…. I did nothing wrong. I never do here. Trying to compare this place to Western to try to make me look bad pisses me off, so thanks.

    • Rob "Wrath" S.E. Portland says:

      And Carl? 2nd chances? For whom. Not me… You mean 15th chance for them? Don’t you get it…. No, you don’t. There will be no cooling off.

      I’m just stunned on what part you all don’t understand on “I login to talk about weather, and yet see myself being bashed, or personally insulted, etc. ” What part of this don’t you get? You don’t get it even when I ignore them others respond either in my defense or when these jackasses insult others. It cracks me you to tell ME to stop this and be the bigger man… Hilarious. I never started it. (See where I login to chat weather and how I’ve never personally attacked or insulted anyone without any justifiable reason. See where I don’t put people down too.) …. The days of me being nice and ignoring it are over.

    • Rob "Wrath" S.E. Portland says:

      Oh and Carl, you may want to see below where Mat brought it up(Not me) mocking me, yeah it was mocking me, and the entire situation acting like some goddamn saint. Like I said I login to chat weather, give analysis, answer questions… If I have to put up with being personally attacked and those responsible are going to not be banned then oh well not my problem if I respond to them. Am I not worth anything better? Really I have to “put up” with this crap? Wrong. No way in hell will I or anyone have to put up with crap when we aren’t doing anything wrong.

    • Snow-Zone/Monmouth-Elv200' says:

      Is all this criticizing of Rob happening in some other chat room? I don’t see any bashing on the comments from today on this blog, where is it coming from? I never see where these fights break out for some reason.

    • Annie in Vancouver ~330 ft. says:

      Snowzone – the posts from earlier were removed by Mark. That is where this began.

    • WEATHERDAN says:

      Rob there are always going to be insensative jerks out there like the ones that were bashing you. That’s just the way it is. Small minded people who feel that by trashing others it will make them feel better. All you can do is try to ignore them. I should have posted online about this when it was happening. Not because you can’t take care of yourself. But because it is
      everybodies duty to speak out against cyber bullying. We value what you have to say. If you stop posting here you give those idiot’s just what they wanted. To silence you. Don’t let that happen. Please resume posting.

  14. What a strange weather day. I’ve been on the edge of precip all day as it wobbled in and out until finally giving us a good soaking.

  15. Josh "The Snowman" From Everett,WA says:

    Man, must be some serious snow on Mt. Hood right now with that deformation band just sitting there.

  16. According to Cliff Mass, (His blog), Seattle has a chance to have it’s warmest January on record. Won’t be surprised!

    46.2F…Light rain…0.10″ so far

  17. Mat the Salmon Killer says:

    Snowing in Redmond

    • Josh "The Snowman" From Everett,WA says:

      Welcome brother. Still snowing there?

    • Mat the Salmon Killer says:

      Very light though… And the temp is around 35 degrees. I heard you, Dave, and Rob were rumbling earlier. Knock it off ok! Remember the poor folks in Haiti. Awesome benefits concert going on nbc right now.

  18. Mat the Salmon Killer says:

    Snowed most of the day here in Redmond. To warm though, sticking, but melting as well. probably turn to ice tonight

  19. Now, my main concern is this: SPIDERS!

    They’re out spinning webs already! Very bad. . .

    I would be very happy if they were gone (snow would accomplish that. . . ) Sadly, I see no real super-cold air coming our direction. . . 😦

    • Annie in Vancouver ~330 ft. says:

      I have noticed that too! I was REALLY hoping that the cold weather we had in December would’ve knocked em out a bit longer, but nooooo. The hardy lil jerks… 😉

    • Sandi (Wilsonville) says:

      “The most common predators of spiders are: birds, wasps, frogs, and scorpions.”

      I vote for birds. 😉 I have noticed that there’s been lots of birds lately also, so hopefully that’ll help keep the spider population under control.

  20. Josh "The Snowman" From Everett,WA says:

    Anyone know how it’s supposed to be on Sunday?

  21. Mark Nelsen says:

    Apparently today was the wrong day to visit two schools and show up to work late (4pm). But, the situation should be taken care of now. I don’t want to hear anymore about it OR spend another half hour on childish issues.

    How about that rain?

  22. Stevengibson says:

    Thank you mark! 🙂

  23. Punxsutawney (aka HIO Phil at work by Sunset High) ~280' says:

    Funny you show mention “splitty” Mark, that’s excactly how the the 06z GFS looked to me for the most part. Splitty and/or ridgy for the next 10 days.

  24. Karl Bonner says:

    Here’s an interesting question about spring snow: in the Midwest, how far south is it possible to get significant snow accumulations in the late March / early April time frame?

    It seems to me that since much of the Midwest is actually at a slightly lower latitude than the Willamette Valley, any Arctic air masses would be even MORE prone to getting modified by the strong spring sun! Yet somehow the cold air can penetrate the middle of the continent further into spring than it can penetrate the western continent. It’s also the case that the midsection gets more serious cold in early fall than we do – highs in the 50s, even upper 40s, on a late September day are not particularly unusual in the upper Midwest, but it takes a real fluke for them to occur in Oregon that early in the season.

    • pappoose in scappoose says:

      Marine influence.

    • Punxsutawney (aka HIO Phil at work by Sunset High) ~280' says:


      The artic airmasses in the Midwest start out a lot colder since there is no moderating Pacific infuence, so even though there may be plenty of sun, the air is starting from a much lower temp to begin with.

    • pappoose in scappoose says:

      The air doesn’t have to travel over the ocean.

  25. Mr Data says:

    What about the GRANDOISE system you guys were mentioning a few days ago?

    I told my dad about it but I guess I should tell him it aint going to happen.

    Seems like topics switch here so fast it makes your head spin and then when asked about a previous topic people forget it was even there.

    • pgiorgio says:

      I agree the mention of Grandiose was a bit overexaggerated. These terms are used loosely by some people and give people the wrong impression.

    • pappoose in scappoose says:

      The GRANDIOSE term was introduced by the NWS in relation to the “clumping” of systems.

  26. Jesse-Orchards says:

    I don’t really understand the idea of the warm January so far “completely negating” the cold December. It’s not like it made it never happen, or erased it from our memories or the record books. I think “balanced out” is probably a better term. There seems to be a lot of reluctance to give December ’09 credit around here, not sure why.

    As for warm Januaries, of course there was January 1953, which was the warmest ever. It had an average temp of like 47 in Portland, ~8 degrees above average, while PDX is ~5 above right now. The last ten days of this month will bring our averages a bit closer to normal this time around, maybe even with a freeze or two!

  27. Yevgeniy aka Yev says:
    around 175W and 37N is I think our finale storm

  28. W7ENK says:

    My dad has quite a story about “one of the worst snow storms (he’d) ever seen” occurring over nearly the entirety of spring break his Junior or Senior year at Centennial. He said it began snowing on Friday night at the very beginning of Spring Break (end of March) and when all was said and done, he had almost 2 feet out at his place, drifts of 3 to 5 feet, and frigid cold until the second weekend of Spring Break. He was born in 1947, so that would have been March of 1964 or 1965. This was also corroborated by my buddy’s Dad, he’s the same age as my Dad, and he went to High School in Clackamas. My Mom also “recall(s) some snow on Spring Break once, growing up.”

    I’ll have to call my Dad and confirm some of those details, but use that as a rough sketch… PORTLAND CAN HAVE SIGNIFICANT SNOW INTO THE END OF MARCH!!!

    • Mark Nelsen says:

      Couldn’t have been either 1964 or 1965 because highs were in the 50s to 70s the 2nd half of both years. There was one day it was 43 for a high at PDX in 1965 though. In fact nowhere between 1960 and 1968 was there anything close to snow (highs mainly 55-75) in March. He must have meant Christmas Break?

      What about 1960? The 2nd through 5th (4 days) was quite a cold spell with highs only in the mid-30s at PDX. Could have stayed below freezing out there at Centennial/Gresham in that pattern. Maybe they used to do Spring Break earlier? He would have been 13 or 14?

    • W7ENK says:

      I very distinctly remember him saying Spring Break… I’ll have to call and ask him for some details tomorrow, but I know he said Spring Break! That’s the part that stands out most in my mind, because it sounded so crazy! He lived out in what was rural farmland that is now urban Gresham at the time, so Gorge influence may have played a roll? I don’t know, I wasn’t around back then, but I will find out!

    • pgiorgio says:

      He walked 10 miles to school in that snow storm? Give him a few more years and it will be 4 feet of snow with 8 foot drifts.
      Nothing personal here against you or your dad. Just kidding, but doesnt it seem like storms are sensationalized more and more the older people get.
      My Dad and many other folks tell stories of walking to school it some very rough conditions back in the day. I actually believe conditions may have been rough for anyone walking to school in the winter months, but as decades pass the stories always seem to get dramatized

    • Jesse-Orchards says:

      It was March of 1960.

    • ..the only spring snow i can remember from “back then” must have been 1960, or thereabouts; i remember making snow angels as an (approximately) 6 year old and putting a notation of such on my science fair weather project…

  29. Historic??…Pressure readings near 29″ now for several days? Amazing!

    51F….Light ESE wind.

  30. Mr Data says:

    So what about the GRANDOISE system thatyou guys were chatting about?

    Is all our low pressure systems done?

    The NWS said something about a GRANDOISE system and you guys made/cracked jokes thinking it meant Grand Finale or something like that early next week.

    I don’t know how to spell fancy words so sorry. 😦

  31. O.C.Paul says:

    Portland’s all time record low temp was set on February 2, 1950 at 3 below zero

    • Tyler in Hazel Dell says:

      Mine (since 1996) is 7.2 on February 2, 1996.

    • Steve Pierce (Vancouver, WA.) says:

      …and the greatest arctic blast since January/February 1950 struck in the first week of February 1989! Also, it has been since February 1993 when we last saw a good dump of snow locally. So, we are overdue in several areas. However, I hate to say this, but El Nino has a pretty good grip on us this year, so I would be really surprised if we see anything else this winter, other than a great AMS meeting this weekend! 🙂


    • W7ENK says:

      February 1993?!? What about December 2008??? I had 23 1/2 inches in my yard last Christmas… by FAR the most snow here in at least 30 years, and my first white Christmas ever! Or was it just a weird dream???

    • pgiorgio says:

      El stinko is my new name for El Nino

  32. Tyler in Hazel Dell says:

    I’ll be there taking pics I’m sure…look your best everyone!

  33. Big Nel says:

    Our home in Chandler Az is getting nailed tonight. My son is staying there and hooked up his cam so we can watch the storm. Tons of rain and palm trees blowing sideways. lots of red & yellow on the radar all evening. We’ll be poolside by March……. I hope. Who knows with El Nino.

  34. Steve Pierce (Vancouver, WA.) says:


    Please consider forwarding the follow information (below) to at least 5 other people (via facebook / twitter / e-mail lists, etc…) who might be interested in joining our awesome chapter of the AMS and/or just attending this weekend’s great meeting. We want to pack the house out Saturday. Here is the information to forward along —


    This is going to be a great meeting. Bring a weather friend along with you. Great pizza, great beverages, and a good meeting. All public / all ages welcome!

    When: SATURDAY, JANUARY 23rd 2-4pm!
    Where: STARK STREET PIZZA – 9234 SE Stark Street
    Topic: How to interpret weather charts and model soundings, presented by AMS councilor Steve Pierce

    This will be a great opportunity to learn how to interpret weather charts and model soundings (great for forecasting potential snow events). We hope you can make it.

    Check for updates at our website:

    Oregon AMS

  35. Runrain says:

    Check out that cell right now passing right thru LA. Looks pretty nasty!

  36. Jethro (Molalla ~320') says:

    I’m whining because my zonal flow is down in Cali! I want my jet stream back! 😦

    • boydo3 N Albany says:

      I ain’t whining today. Too nice! And the coastal rivers are prime for steelhead fishing this weekend!
      Now for some more snow in the mountains for a GREAT February skiing season and I am “as happy as a clam fritter in hot oil”!

  37. …ok, can’t whine, but maybe a little pouting and kicking the dirt?….

  38. Battle Ground Brian says:

    60 degrees briefly today in Brush Prairie around 3:00pm.

  39. dabears (Hillsboro-Tanasbourne) says:

    Holy crap! My grandmother’s neighborhood in Ventura, CA was hit by a tornado today! Unbelievable!

    • dabears (Hillsboro-Tanasbourne) says:

      Wow, and now my hometown of Thousand Oaks is under a severe thunderstorm warning. My mom said she just lost her whole backyard fence and a massive branch from the 50 foot tree behind the house just fell and hit the roof, broke a few windows. I can’t believe I just moved out 2 weeks before the most severe weather that I would have ever seen in my 18 years in Southern California.

    • Brad says:

      Take a gander at Phoenix’s NWS site. 20+ different watches and warnings including a possible tornado in Phoenix and a blizzard warning in the mountains around Tucson.

  40. Adam in SE says:

    Well, I’m choosing to be optimistic, and I raked the 3 inches of rotting leaves off part of the garden today. Many sad-looking yellow shoots under there.

  41. Sean in Felida says:

    Josh in Everett may remember this one: Feb 1989 light snow followed by very cold air that stuck around for a week, followed by a March snowstorm that dumped almost a foot on the east side of Auburn. One day it was very windy and temps in the 50’s, mid 30’s by the following afternoon, then snow all night and most of the next day with temps below freezing. I know models aren’t pointing towards anything like that in the future, but it is possible.

  42. Timmy_Supercell (Hillsboro) says:

    One thing I have a hard time understanding today is how Southern CA is even capable of having the atmospheric conditions favorable for tornadic thunderstorms in the middle of Winter. And these aren’t the run of the mill “cold core” type, more like thunderstorms at least from the Rockies.

    • Rob "Wrath" S.E. Portland says:

      Mark, thanks for the update….

      Well splitty means a cold pool may develop east side. Not overly strong I’d assume, but just enough.
      Timmy, the jet stream aiming right over their region was 200mph. Tremendous upper level support. They also had cold air aloft streaming in. It’s happened many other times. These aren’t supercells like the midwest, but they definitely aren’t the piddly cold core convection type storms we see.

  43. blowmedown says:

    Wow1 what a great day for a walk in the park with the kids… looks like things get back to normal though next week and maybe even a bit cooler into begining of February?

  44. Timmy_Supercell (Hillsboro) says:

    Right. Winter is definitely not at all over. Remember ladies and gentlemen, winter officially ends on “March 21st”. Not next week 🙂

    • Timmy_Supercell (Hillsboro) says:

      I wouldn’t however count that cold snap as part of our Winter, since it happened like about 2 weeks before Winter started.

    • Eternal Yamcha (SE Milwaukie) says:

      It really depends, Tim as there are two dates that winter starts… Though one’s TECHNICALLY the OFFICIAL start date. You’ve got…

      1. Astronomical Winter (Not sure if that’s the official definition): The day of the Winter Solstice is the start of winter and the Spring Equinox marks the end of it. Makes sense to me. But I prefer looking at the…

      2. Meteorological Winter: December 1st is the first day of winter and the end of it is February 28th/29th. This one is also the one that most people tend to agree with from what I’ve gathered over the years. Most people see December as a Winter month, not an Autumn month. March (here in Portland, at least) is averagely warmer than November – February… So I can see why so many people prefer Meteorological Winter. Not to mention it’s WAY easier to keep track of as it encompasses whole months.

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